Poetics and Poetry Discussion

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  • Rookie Andrew Konisberg (6/13/2005 10:21:00 PM) Post reply
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    okay. I have decided not to leave a mark on poets' works from this point on. I will only leave a comment on a work that has caused me to remark upon it. I would encourage anyone that that reads my work NOT to leave a mark but all comments are gratefully appreciated. I've never liked marking other people's poems anyway because I think it is a bit insulting to the poet's intelligence whose work I'm reading. there are a few people here who only leave comments anyway...so, I say, anybody that would care to join the 'comments-only' approach to do so. thus 1/10's become entirely irrelevant. I've just looked and I'm on a reasonable average rating-per-poem.I will willingly let that rating slide to 0.1 by encouraging people NOT to mark me but simply leave a comment upon one of my poems if they liked it. thus, anybody who quibbles about the churlishness of numerical ratings (with fair reason) can join me in calling others not to numerically grade their work and offer comments instead. then we will see who will 'put their money where their mouth is'.

  • Rookie David Zvekic (6/13/2005 10:35:00 AM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    Is this the correct forum to actually discuss poemhunter.com itself?

    I would think no. But there is no other forum more appropriate that I can tell.

    With such a forum the administrators could more easily determine how to
    improve this sight rather than rely on meaningless polls.

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    • Rookie Michael Shepherd (6/14/2005 7:45:00 AM) Post reply

      David, info@poemhunter.com gets daily feedback from around the world, which is often answered directly. Or you could air your suggestions here?

  • Rookie Michael Shepherd (6/13/2005 9:06:00 AM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    Sonja, I've just checked 'First Kiss' which has 33 ratings but no hits on the actual poem... now that's seriously weird! Such a readily recognisable situation you've described too. But whatever your individual ratings, your page-visit stats are doing fine? Anyone any clues? Sue Casey, you're the expert on this situation?

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  • Rookie t. h. ashbury (6/10/2005 4:07:00 PM) Post reply

    good afternoon all,

    i've just started posting here and finally figured out how to post to the forum. i'm playing a bit with form and would welcome any response(s) to my work that any of you might offer. thanks and best wishes.

  • Rookie ***** ***** (6/10/2005 11:08:00 AM) Post reply | Read 3 replies

    Well, sorry but that's it for me - and this time I'm afraid I wouldn't have the stomach to come back (at the risk of sounding like a certain person) . In one night my work bombed from an average of about 8.8/9 gradings per poem (a general average of about 9.0 to an average of 5.0) to the 4.3 mark per poem. All poems had many more votes today than yesterday and they were all obviously ones. I wouldn't be sensitive to votes really, but when people take out unexplained vendettas on my work, well, I just won't put it out there for that.

    Thanks for all the kind comments from those who bothered to read the poetry, but that's about all I can take. Good luck to the decent folk here - and God help the spare parts.

    Sonja Broderick.

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    • Rookie Rev. Dr. A. Jacob Hassler (6/10/2005 1:17:00 PM) Post reply

      what Kenneth said. really, Sonja, you have written some profound work just the short time you've been back. one-givers be damned, we all know you're a better poet than that. Jake

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  • Rookie Michael Shepherd (6/10/2005 6:12:00 AM) Post reply

    Whoops! Misquote: 'mesmerising'.

  • Rookie Michael Shepherd (6/10/2005 6:06:00 AM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    This offering is made in the spirit of 21st century universal world poetry and in what I hope is our understanding that there is a place both for poems and their discussion:

    I've been looking at Nikhil's 'Kiss' poem and trying to work out why it doesn't work for me.

    The adage which I have attempted to follow in all my own writing, prosaic and poetic, for many years, and for which I cannot express my gratitude too strongly, comes indirectly from the Hindu teachings and above all from Adi Shankara, that great philosopher who has shaped India's thinking since 800 AD/CE and who was also a poet: 'Words mean what they do'. In Hindu terms, every word has a direct relationship and a revelation of the essential unity of Creation. This I would imagine is also Nikhil's view.

    There is a celebrated practical demonstration of this today in police advice: it is more effective, we are told, if you spot a burglar running from your house, to shout 'Fire' rather than 'Stop Thief': it gets people out of their houses to help you more effectively!

    Poetry works by evocation in the reader - the words mean what they 'do' to you. And we all have our individual responses. Nikhil's essential idea in this poem is a sweet and universal one: to remind us that we all hope that our first kiss, and later our first copulation, will bring down heaven and earth; be universal; be the greatest thing that ever happened to us; make sense of our life; etc. Even a flash of 'heat lightning' over the hills would not be inappropriate as a heavenly acknowledgement! And Nikhil ranges through the wealth of Creation to evoke this. Great idea.

    However, for me, Nikhil's use of English grammar - which is universal, as Sanskrit grammar is, and some say, more universally within its own language - works against his intention. Poetry evokes in the maximum number of readers by the openness of its evocation. As soon as one loads a noun or a verb with a 'qualifying' adjective or adverb, their generality is more often diminished than expanded. And when an adjective is 'qualified' by an adverb, the evocation becomes personalised to the poet in a way that can squeeze out the reader. Most English teachers would warn their students right off this usage.

    Take the two lines Andrew finds interesting:

    'timelessly stupefying serendipity of the euphoric meadows';
    'intriguingly inscrutable storm of mesmerisingly artistry';

    if words indeed 'mean what they do', the reader is being asked, in the first line, to experience in mind and heart, five diverse responses in order to follow the poem's extended metaphor - 'I wished it to be an earth-shattering, heavenly experience'; and in the second, to consider the artistry of the Creator in four diverse mental responses in relation to this hopefully universal event. Magnifying of the idea of the poem is constantly defeated by personal minifying - or in Hindu terminology, *aham* is constantly being overlaid by *ahamkara*. For Western ears, this is called 'overwriting'.

    Comparisons can be odious; but compare, for evocation, Aamish Ameya's poem 'Intercourse'. In Nikhil's poem, the reader does one sort of evocative work; in Aamish's poem, another. Some may like one; some the other.

    This is my analysis of my response to Nikhil's poem, in, I hope, the spirit of this Forum. I apologise if it seems pompous, pretentious, or negative.

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    • Rookie Andrew Konisberg (6/10/2005 6:37:00 AM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

      yes, I agree with what your saying, Michael. I liked those particular two lines BECAUSE (I'm not shouting, I'd indent the word 'because' if I could!) they were pompous...I don't mind the odd overwrit ... more

  • Rookie - 150 Points Poetry Hound (6/6/2005 2:21:00 PM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    I've noticed that there are some poetry sites that require you to provide comments on other people's poems if you want to post your own. I'm not sure such a requirement is warranted here (since a lot of the comments would be perfunctory) but it sure would cut down on these mass postings of poems.

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    • Rookie - 150 Points Sue Casey (6/6/2005 3:52:00 PM) Post reply

      I am not sure that it would. The one you finally made comment on seems to be posting a lifetimes work on the board. I had this fear that first it was painstakingly translated into a new language...on ... more

  • Rookie Aidan Ross (6/5/2005 7:38:00 AM) Post reply

    Chris, I would like to submit my poem 'Why' to your competition, also I think you would probably like 'Global Psychosis' and maybe 'Birth of Despair'

  • Rookie Aidan Ross (6/5/2005 6:39:00 AM) Post reply

    It looks like 'Beauty Imposes' is about the wonders we percive of Beauty and also its true irrevalance.

    BTW I am not a proffesionall poet I am just a teenager who wrote a few poems, during one particularly unusual February

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